Comments and Notes:
2009-05-11 This voter's 2 cents
Sheriff Dupnik is 100% correct. Those here illegally are criminals. They are overcrowding schools and taking from a system that they do not put into. They are more than welcome to come here legally. I also believe that non citizens should not be able to get food stamps or Govt. funds for anything." --guest
2009-05-11 sad and frustrating
I don't understand how this belief that 'they are taking from a system they do not put into' is so widespread. "Illegals" are our neighbors, nannies, gardeners, construction workers, restaurant workers. There is a very good chance that the meat you eat was packed by an 'illegal', that the lettuce you buy was picked by an 'illegal' and the house you live in was built by an 'illegal'. I know a woman who went to my same high school and she has been 'illegal' most of her life, it is just something she lives with hanging over her. She does all her shopping here in town, pays sales taxes, pays rent, works hard for low pay, and no, she does not get any government services. How is she 'not putting into the system'?
Also consider the case of a child, a US Citizen, who lives in fear that his mother may be deported. How fair is it to subject him to this fear at school, that if he says the wrong thing the school will help 'big brother' swoop down and deport his family? Or are we now calling names and choosing who is a citizen and who is not unconstitutionally? The bill of rights in the Constitution was specifically written to prevent the majority from stripping rights away from any 'unfavored group'. --gv
2009-05-04 the logic
In response to the person who commented 'where's the logic': There are two parts to this issue. One is the actual assertion Dupnik made, that undocumented persons are a problem or drain on the system. This assertion is arguable, as another comment in this stream notes.
The other issue, however, does not depend on the logic/truth of the 'problem' assertion. That is, by making a blanket accusation at a segment of the community, and further asserting that schools should assist with law enforcement, Dupnik is creating a climate of fear and intimidation that directly conflicts with the primary mission of law enforcement, which is to 'Protect and Serve' the community at large. If Sheriff Dupnik can no longer be effective in defending a large segment of our community when they have been victimized by criminals (because the climate of fear will prevent victims from coming forward, asking for help, or testifying against the perpetrators), then he can no longer be an effective sheriff. This is separate from the truth or falsehood of the "problem/drain" assertion. If, for example, Sheriff Dupnik had asserted that "Italians are a problem", or "Jews are a problem", he would immediately have been excoriated and fired. But because this segment of the communitity can be singled out based on 'legal' grounds instead of strictly racial grounds, it is 'ok' to target them. I think we are forgetting that most police states and generally vicious societies first passed laws to make the targetted segment of the community 'illegal'. This happened to the Cherokee indians in the Trail of Tears, it happened to Mexican residents shortly after WWII when returning soldiers needed jobs (that is when the requirements for documentation started, I believe; I'm not a historian and need to check), and happened to many other peoples in history. So please do not be swayed by the 'illegal' label. That is the first step down a very problematic road. --gv
2009-05-03
whats wrong with his comments? Undocumented immigrants do drain our system immensely. Not all but quite a few drug and gang related crimes in Tucson involve illegals. So I don't see anything wrong in his statement. Illegal immigration needs to be cut down in this country. --guest
2009-05-03 Where's the logic?
Because Dupnik argues that illegal immigrants drain US resources, this writer counters that Dupnik ignores that illegals are also victims of crime. That does not logically follow as there is no connection established. It does, however, cloud the argument by distracting from the point made and sets up a straw argument that is irrelevant. --guest
2009-05-03 assumption
I don't think that 'undocumented immigrants drain our system immensely' is an accurate assumption, even though it seems to be widely held. Undocumented immigrants usually are working, buying groceries (so paying sales taxes), renting apartments (so contributing towards property taxes) and often having taxes deducted from their paychecks which they will never benefit from, as they are denied most government benefits such as social security. Not to mention the profit the businesses that hire them make from the result of their labor. How does a working resident of our city 'drain the system' so much just because they lack paperwork? Actually with our aging population, the undocumented immigrants are probably contributing an above-average percentage into the system.
The problem is not that they are draining the system, the problem is that because of the lack of documentation hospitals may have trouble being reimbursed as they are not covered by health insurance. This is a problem of lack of equal protection under the law, not one of taking advantage. Generally only strong capable persons are able to make the difficult trek across the border, and they do so in search of work, not services.
A simple solution to the 'drain the system' issue would be to just legalize the large worker population and create a legal channel for more workers to come here, perhaps with the requirement that they prepurchase health insurance before arriving, and maybe pay a one time fee into the public school system if they bring children. This would be less onorous than the current non-system, and less dangerous for all involved.
As to the issue of competition for jobs, I'd like to see the government provide small business grants to citizens and long time residents so that they could profit from the influx of cheap labor rather than competing with it. Alternatively, additional grants for continuing education in affected populations would provide another channel for self-improvement for any workers who feel they are impacted by competition.
All the problems can be solved with mutual respect and some creativity. There is no need to attack entire parts of our community. " --guest
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